Disturbing

[cory]

http://www.dpmclimbing.com/articles/view/just-cleaning

[Stacey]

disturbing indeed...glad they caught them on tape...hard to refute it!

[Dom]

I've tried watching the video but it doesn't seem to work.

The culprit is Ivan Greene. A famous climber from NYC who suffers from Napoleon complex...

Here he is climbing a pretty cool problem (although prob. chipped ) at 5:10 of the video. http://vimeo.com/39248560

Remember the magazine urban climber? I've always wondered what an urban climber is...this guys seems to answer my question...

[Dom]

http://www.dpmclimbing.com/climbing-videos/watch/hammered-and-chiseled

After watching the video, it seems obvious he's manufacturing holds and not ''just cleaning''. This is clearly unacceptable.

That being said, anyone who watches this, don't assume automatically that anyone using a hammer, or a crow bar on a route is ''chipping''.

Route developers in NB often use such tools to make the route safe from loose rocks. Sometimes, there's a fine line between cleaning and chipping but I think all developers adhere to the no chipping philosophy and use their judgment when faced with a ''grey zone'' situation.

This video makes it seem like the tools are key evidence, when in fact it's the intention behind them IMO.

So to end my rant, If you chip a route, expect to be ostracized from the community, but if you clean a new route properly, you'll end up with your name in a guidebook.

[cory]

Agreed, Dom. I especially like your closing.

For the uninitiated:
Often it is safest to use a crowbar, rather than pulling barehanded on a flexing flake*. The latter will likely end with bloody fingers, a self-punch in the face, and a hunk of rock in the crotch. (It only took me three tries to learn this lesson.) Since steel is usually harder than said flake, sometimes the edges and crystals crumble under the first few pry attempts, so it takes a few whacks with a hammer to wedge the crowbar deep enough to get a purchase on the loose rock.
*Deciding to leave a flexing flake in place is an option that is considered by me and every other FAist I've been involved with. In a nutshell, if it's likely to come off soon on it's own (through erosion in say 10 years, or under the pressure of a climber in 2) the decision is typically made to pry it off, so that the above injuries do not occur to a climber, nor rockfall onto belayers/spotters/gawkers.

Carving "enhancements" to make edges more (or less) in-cut, more (or less) prominent, larger (or smaller) is NOT acceptable. Aggressively scrubbing at loose crystals is cool... chipping/filing sharp edges into friendly holds is NOT acceptable. Test blows with a hammer prior to bolt installation is mandatory... recklessly bashing away at features is NOT acceptable. Hammers are also used to install bolts. This list is not complete -When in doubt, leave it alone.

[Joe]

... recklessly bashing away at features is NOT acceptable.

I've been doing this all winter and no one seems to mind....

[*Chris*]

This has been the wildest internet kerfuffle involving the climbing community in a while.

*One minute the video is up... then it's down
*The big forums are raging... then they're all shut down
*Rock & Ice Magazine isn't reporting it... then they are... then they aren't again
*This guys is defending himself online... then it's said to be a troll... or is it?
*Someone's claiming that he was 'restoring' the damage caused by a previous chipper
*Rumors that this guy has 'lawyered up' for slander and libel?
*The video is authentic... then it's part of a documentary... then it's authentic again
*He's sponsored by Edelrid... then he's not... then he hasn't been for a while
*It's on the Mohonk private preserve... then it's not...

The whole thing makes about as much sense as the Chewbacca Defence!

One thing's for sure... I bet most landowners don't give a tinker's damn about chipping holds into a rock in the woods somewhere. Compared to graffiti, this is a non-issue. What they probably do get concerned about is reading how someone should have been beat to death on their land over this nonsense. Climbers are not well served by anyone spouting that kind of reaction.

[Dom]

Agreed with you there. Mountain Project seems to be like the new RC.com. I didn't dare to go check the forums on that site....

This is an ethical issue that will stay within the boundaries of the climbing community. The only way this makes it into a court of law is on Judge Judy....Wouldn't it be interesting though? hahahah

[JasonRain]

glad they caught them on tape