New Route -Pooh Corner

[cory]

Siren Song5.9/10a (needs confirmation) pg 120'/N/B(1)
FA/FFA C Goodman, J Simpson Aug 11, 2010

Start in the finger crack just left of the Eeyore's House gully. Climb up the series of short faces that form the broad arete at the right end of Pooh Corner. Finish at the summit, using the Honey Pot anchors (a fixed sling and possibly overtightened rap ring, but you can back it up with a small cam). Walk-off or Rap Honey Pot.

Some committing moves on sloping holds with nice views and exposure.

It's still a bit dirty, so you may want to hang off until after I give it a polish next week.

[PeterA]

What leads you to believe that it is overtightened? As far as I know, everything on that anchor is solid

-PJ

[cory]

What leads you to believe that it is overtightened?

Externally the bolt looks and feels snug, but a good portion of the stud is protruding. It's double nutted and still has a few winds of exposed threads. So it definitely isn't deep. One explanation could be because it's been overtightened, so to err on the side of caution I figured it was best to include the parenthetical warning. This was not an attack on the anchor or it's placer.

I did scrub the route for a couple hours last Wed (17th), but it was slower going than anticipated, so I'm trying to get back up this week to do the bottom half.

[motanb]

Cory: so you are able to determine the entire length of the bolt based upon the observation of the exposed shaft? Last time I checked I do believe bolts came in various lengths ,dimensions etc. A friendly consideration:-)

[Fred]

The marking on the tip of the shaft generaly indicates the length of bolt used so it is possible that Cory knows the length of the bolt used.

[seanT]

"tip of the shaft?" can you keep it clean!

[Andrew]

http://www.hilti.ca/holca/page/module/product/prca_rangedetail.jsf?lang=en&nodeId=-60535
This bolt is a long thread bolt. Maybe this was used. In addition the the route in question, I've noticed that J'ai Vole ta Blonde's anchors are crazy long threaded. Maybe this is the case here too? Hope so, otherwise those bolts are just barely in there. Pretty scary. Anyone know the story behind that route's anchors?

[cory]

Cory, so you are able to determine the entire length of the bolt based upon the observation of the exposed shaft? Last time I checked I do believe bolts came in various lengths ,dimensions etc. A friendly consideration:-)

No, Tom, I can't see the entire length of the bolt, so once again reiterate:

(a fixed sling and possibly overtightened rap ring, but you can back it up with a small cam).

Note the careful choice of the word "possibly".

I didn't place the anchor myself, yet I'm relying on it's use for the new route that I established. I feel, as a first ascentionist, I must take some responsibility for the cleaning and equipping of a new route to minimize potential dangers. Hence the heads-up in the provided description.

If you want the whole story because a parenthesis in a description is inadequate for you, here it is:

As I reached the summit of the route, I came to an existing anchor who's history was unknown to me. The sling which is somewhat stiff and has lost some pigment, looked OK. The shank of the bolt is protruding an inch or so, but looked OK. The length of the bolt isn't really relevant . The expansion portion is only about an inch, regardless of the shank length. The expansion sleeve reaches the end of the bolt after being tightened about the thickness of the nut, assuming it catches immediately. This doesn't always happen, which is one potential explanation; the sleeve didn't catch until the bolt had been backed out a few turns. In this case, it can be considered solid. Another potential explanation is that it caught right away and for some reason was tightened further which has pulled some of the bolt through the expansion sleeve. There may be other explanations, but they didn't come to mind during the ascent. There was enough potential for me to question the integrity of the anchor, so I placed a small cam to the point I felt I had a SRENE anchor to secure myself to and belay the second. We walked off.

Since then PJ has asked why I questioned the bolts integrity (notice, still it's "questioning", not saying it's bad). He thinks its solid, but has yet to provide an explanation for the protrusion that will alleviate all my concerns, so I stand by the original route description.

Siren Song 5.9/10a (needs confirmation) pg 120'/N/B(1)
FA/FFA C Goodman, J Simpson Aug 11, 2010

Start in the finger crack just left of the Eeyore's House gully. Climb up the series of short faces that form the broad arete at the right end of Pooh Corner. Finish at the summit, using the Honey Pot anchors (a fixed sling and possibly overtightened rap ring, but you can back it up with a small cam). Walk-off or Rap Honey Pot.

Some committing moves on sloping holds with nice views and exposure.

The route has now been fully cleaned. Get on it.

[JonA]

How do you over-tighten a rap ring?

[granite_grrl]

Are you sure it is over tightened? It might not have been pounded in deep enough in the first place or maybe (more likely around here then on the granite you guys climb on) it hit a pocket of or a section of poor rock, in which case you have to tighten till it catches.

IMO the rock out in NB is way more solid than the limestone I've been climbing on out here in Ontario. You still have a flowers ton of holding power even if you lose a cm of length with it. If this is a rap ring I assume that there are two bolts there as well so you even have a back up?

[PeterA]

The sling was added by me last year, since there was only one rap ring there. Aside from that, I don't know anything about the bolt, I was just curious to know why.

-PJ

[STeveA]

The bolt was placed by me, and I often put 2 nuts on the end to prevent the anchor from coming loose. I do not believe it was over tightened. The bolts I often use are Red Hat stainless steel, and they are fully threaded as shown in Andrews pic. Even with 2 nuts on the end, there is still about 2" of bolt into the granite. Since the bolt has been there for over 10 years, I suspect it was safe (getting older now(bolt, not me)). There was only 1 bolt placed because there is a great placement with the sling through the rock, again early days of bolts so we placed as few as possible.

[Dom]

Aside from all this bolt talk, I got on the route this weekend and I have to say it's a nice route for sure!!
As for the grade, I would say that there are two 5.8/5.9 cruxes and the rest flows well so the overall grade of the route is not harder than 5.9.

Up there is probably the nicest view of the Cocrane Lane cliffs...so I recommend it!

[cory]

Thanks Steve.

There you have it, everyone; the history of the bolt.

[Stacey]

We got on this and it was a great route. The mantle was fun (mental on lead I'm sure)...and the second crux was fun moves (hands on the crack & face holds)...

I'd say it was a 5.8/5.8+ grade....


Stacey